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Post by Dashe on Nov 1, 2010 19:32:08 GMT -5
I really hope you're right, Hershel, because barely-literate fanboys will be requesting something exactly like that until the game hits the shelves. :17:
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Post by hershel on Nov 1, 2010 19:42:10 GMT -5
Capcom hasn't caved in to the "PHOENIX WRIGHT CAN STILL BE IN MVC3 YOU GUYS" dipwads yet. I'm sure you have nothing to worry about.
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Post by Raijin on Nov 1, 2010 20:21:11 GMT -5
Don't the Legends games take place at least 6000 years after the main series or something? Yeah, no, even if the fanboys get a vote in, I really don't see anything like what you're describing happening. If popularity can help him overcome dying 6 or 7 times over the course of 500 years or so, then adding another 6000 isn't going to make much of a difference. You gotta understand that what's at stake here is really the Legends series' independence from the other Megaman games. Bringing in Zero brings with him lots of baggage. It would cease to be about the diggers' adventures and start to be about the epic millenia-spanning tragedy that is the life of Wily's last great creation. Even if it weren't actually Zero and just an expy of Zero, the symbolism of him being there would mark the series' pull back to the same old mainstream Megaman mythos. MML started out with a Rock and a Roll and went off into its own direction far away from the classic. Now, if a "Zero" showed up bearing as much similarity to the original as "Wily" the boat shop owner did to his namesake, then maybe heads wouldn't have to roll, but that's a big maybe. MML fans would rather not take the chance.
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Post by hershel on Nov 1, 2010 20:37:19 GMT -5
If popularity can help him overcome dying 6 or 7 times over the course of 500 years or so, Three times, actually. This is more-than-likely as far as the reference will go, if there even is a reference.
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Post by Pitch on Nov 1, 2010 21:16:54 GMT -5
Now, if a "Zero" showed up bearing as much similarity to the original as "Wily" the boat shop owner did to his namesake, then maybe heads wouldn't have to roll, but that's a big maybe. MML fans would rather not take the chance. Actually, I don't mind this idea at all. I wouldn't mind seeing Zero (or Protoman or Bass) as a partly-fleshed out background character like Wily. And I really hope they have the sense to limit him to that type of role if it does come down to it. In fact, there are dozens of character cameos I wouldn't mind seeing in a similar fashion. Legends really has a way of making its background characters shine. You gotta understand that what's at stake here is really the Legends series' independence from the other Megaman games. This is what gets me because Capcom really wants to make the series accessible to all fans of MegaMan in general, which is not necessarily a bad thing, but it's also why I think a Zero appearance may be something we'll just have to be prepared to accept.
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Post by Raijin on Nov 1, 2010 21:32:12 GMT -5
If popularity can help him overcome dying 6 or 7 times over the course of 500 years or so, Three times, actually. More than that for certain types of death. X1 was the obvious first. X5 offers another. "Goes to sleep" in X6, again some time between X and Zero series, end of MMZ4, end of ZXA if you count Model Z. The way X3 carries out offers another potential one as far as some fans are concerned (can't play him for the rest of the game if he dies once). Basically any time he "disappears" only reappear almost immediately (throw in MMXCM, Zero.exe) is enough to get them to reset the "It has been [_] games since we got rid of Zero forever." sign.
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Post by hershel on Nov 1, 2010 22:07:29 GMT -5
More than that for certain types of death. X1 was the obvious first. X5 offers another. "Goes to sleep" in X6, again some time between X and Zero series, end of MMZ4, end of ZXA if you count Model Z. The way X3 carries out offers another potential one as far as some fans are concerned (can't play him for the rest of the game if he dies once). X5 was meant as the end of the X series and the start of the Zero series. If you're counting X6 and onward (Remember how much Inafune was against continuing the X series, nevermind the plotholes every X series game afterward raised) then you can't really count the Zero series at the same time. ZX is a whole different story considering that whole "biometal" thing (besides, counting Model Z as Zero coming back from the dead again kind of ruins Zero 4's ending), and the fans that take that X3 example seriously sound like the exact same type of Zero fan that everyone's bitching about to begin with. Zero.exe's from a completely unrelated series that (if we're talking chronologically) would only work as an alternate version of the Classic series (both taking place in 200x/20xx), so it's a stretch. Including the Zero series, there's only 3 games where Zero's deaths really count: X1, X5, and Z4. ...I'm taking an argument about how many times a video game character died seriously. I need to go to bed.
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Post by Pitch on Nov 1, 2010 22:19:57 GMT -5
I like how Zero's fans protest that Zero has “only died three times,” when that's still two more times than normal. =)
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Post by Dash on Nov 4, 2010 10:28:09 GMT -5
It's not only about how many times Zero has met his end, either. Zero having any sort of a major role in the game is a smack in the face to us true fans of this particular series. Legends has been the "odd-ball" of the Mega Man games. Adding in Zero would deviant from that and would have the potential of killing the experience we all had from the first two games.
I'm very much against Zero ever being able to touch Legends outside of being a poster-boy. Period. Hell, I really wouldn't mind seeing Rush in the game, but I'm really just against that, because there should be NOTHING from the classic, X, Z, ZX and whatever other BS series they have going in Legends.
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Post by hershel on Nov 7, 2010 21:07:58 GMT -5
Oh, the poster is fiiiiiine. After all, we've had more Legends cameos than we can count on our fingers. But they were never character cameos, just props and nods and references. It's the thought of a dark, brooding guy weaving himself into the plot and stealing Mega Man's thunder that worries most of us. Looking back at this post, I'm seeing something that kind of worries me. Namely, the use of the word "cameo". A character making a cameo wouldn't "weave itself into the plot" and steal the main character's thunder. Hell, said poster is a pretty good example of a cameo, if nothing else. What you're describing in that last sentence is an MGS2 style main character fake-out. I'll never understand why everyone on this forum is so worried about this "OH MY GOD, FAN INPUT, THEY'RE GOING TO PUT ZERO IN THE GAME AND RUIN EVERYTHING" superstition you have. If you really think Capcom's going to listen to people who don't even know how to use periods correctly, you've officially gone mad.
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Post by Pitch on Nov 7, 2010 23:34:24 GMT -5
If we're wrong in calling it a cameo, we're wrong in calling it a cameo. That's just semantics, really. That doesn't change anything about the concerns about a a Zero-based character. (that better?) Although I suppose it could start as a real cameo, then turn into something more. The Zero Virus tends to spread quickly after it infects a MegaMan series. (That's a joke, not an actual prediction xP) If Capcom is honoring the results of anonymous polls to make decisions about the game, a Zero character is a possibility, regardless of the voters' lack of grammatical (or any other) sense. If they do make a poll for that, we may not have the numbers to get the idea shot down; Zero's fanbase outnumbers Legends' fanbase by a hefty margin. (Why would Zero fans be voting in a Legends poll? ... well, probably because they have nothing better to do. There's not an awful lot going on with MegaMan these days.) I don't expect Capcom to make that poll in the first place of course, but if they do, we're probably in trouble... And there are other possibilities beyond polls, but we don't know enough yet to be concerned about that. We don't know much of anything yet, really. I have no idea what to expect these days; Capcom really likes to keep us guessing. Haha. The uncertainty is mostly what's getting to me. I'm on pins and needles, here. (And it still doesn't feel real... x__x) (Maybe I'm just too old :21:) Honestly though, so far the fan input is nothing I'm terribly worried about. It's all hypothetical right now, after all. I'll worry if Capcom actually does something to worry about. At this point, I'm not so much concerned about fan input as taking a jab at the fans. (Of course, I can only speak for myself...)
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Post by hershel on Nov 8, 2010 7:07:51 GMT -5
I don't expect Capcom to make that poll in the first place of course Then stop making such a big deal out of this. At this point, I'm not so much concerned about fan input as taking a jab at the fans. God forbid someone liking something you don't.
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Post by Musashi on Nov 8, 2010 22:33:36 GMT -5
God forbid someone posts their opinion on what they want and don't want in the game, eh Hershel?
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Post by hershel on Nov 9, 2010 7:14:33 GMT -5
God forbid someone posts their opinion on what they want and don't want in the game, eh Hershel? Last I checked, "taking a jab at the fans" has nothing to do with that.
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Post by in·clover on Nov 9, 2010 7:50:11 GMT -5
Last I checked, taking a jab at someone is a little more lighthearted than outright flaming a person. The only thing this discussion proves is how easily butthurt a person can get over a nothing like this.
And I agree with you. Just doesn't seem likely to me that Capcom would do something so brash as to throw in Zero, just to exploit his popularity. Spinoffs like Battle Network have a cast made up almost entirely of fanservicey throwbacks to the main series, and the Zero series is for all intents and purposes a continuation of the X series, that Zero happened to be a part of. There's no logical reason for Zero to be in Legends though, and I think this would be especially obvious to the team developing the game.
This is a prime example of how pointless that fan input thing is. I figured when they introduced this idea, the only thing it would be good for is having fanboys at each other's throats. I really wish they'd just cut the shit and make the game themselves.
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