|
|
Post by General Specific on Oct 2, 2010 15:03:12 GMT -5
WE ARE CURRENTLY IN HALLOWEEN SEASON! DO NOT TAKE OUR NAMES SERIOUSLY--YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO FIGURE OUT WHO ARE ON UNITY...OVER AND OUT! | MML3 Game Speculation--Always bet on the Hippo! | Right, then! Welcome to the Station, fellas! Today, we'll be speculatin' about MML3--the game itself, considering we've had enough plot speculation to water our mouthes for quite a while. Before we start this discussion off, let me point out some interesting links related to our subject matter: www.gamefaqs.com/boards/609523-mega-man-legends-3-project/56563125 "Alright Legends fans lets talk about what should be in the game!" :29:-|_|-| _|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-| _|-|_|-:32: superdanny.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=Talk2&action=display&thread=1533"What would you want in MML 3?" superdanny.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=Talk2&action=display&thread=360"Legends 3 Wish List!" superdanny.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=Talk2&action=display&thread=368"Improvements for future MML3 and TMoTB2" superdanny.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=Talk2&action=display&thread=380"MegaMan Legends 3" (as according to SIMSteven) :29:-|_|-|_|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|_|-|_|-:32: mmls.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=talkmmlgeneral&action=display&thread=899"Create a Special Weapon" mmls.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=talkmml3&action=display&thread=3758"What do you Want in MML3?"[ :29:-|_|-| _|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-|-| _|-|_|-:32: www.capcom-unity.com/devroom/go/thread/view/114725/25961721/So_what_DIDNT_you_like_about_legends?pg=1"So what DIDNT you like about legends?" www.capcom-unity.com/devroom/go/thread/view/114725/25961969/New_Speacial_Weapons"New Special Weapons" --I picked these links out because they all relate to what we want to see in the new game, if not a new Legends game in general. The main interest of this thread is to discuss new game design, special weapons, possible dungeons, mechanics, and other game features we would like to see and could be seeing in MML3, or in general. Everyone loves to this sort of thread for plot speculation and VolnuttX shipping, but rarely for what the actual game will play like. Because the very core of the MML experience lies in the game itself, it was about darn time that someone get a general thread up for this. When I feel that a certain discussion has been carried to its fullest potential, I will decide when to switch to a new topic. Movement and Control of Volnutt, Posts 1-64: Seeing as this was our first discussion, taking over a full day to resolve, we had some issues with staying on topic--aside from these events, the discussion went smoothly. Everyone who participated generally agreed on a new mobility device in-game, either as Hover Boots or as a Jet Pack. Using the device, you could reach exclusive side-areas in numerous side-dungeons, which would be reachable nearing the end of the game or after the story has been completed (some also mentioned their approval of a New Game+ idea, but that will wait for a later discussion). Both the Jet Skates and new item got their own new controls, allowing Volnutt to fire at enemies and move easier with both. We also had a similar discussion around wall-jumping, which generally ended with it being usable as a device in dungeons to add platforming puzzles and more variety in what challenges once could find. We ended the discussion with underwater mobility, which was to be done with a context-sensitive version of the new mobility device (which I shall now refer to as the Hippopotamus out of convenience). This would speed up mobility when underwater, allowing for more complex fight sequences. New Dungeons, Posts 64-99: Although many of the familiar members who participated last discussion participated at first, it soon became a conversation between me and HalcyonDays, who posed to me some very good questions regarding dungeons. The general consensus here is that we want our dungeons to be more challenging (and perhaps scarier, as they already somewhat were in games past), and to hold more diversity in challenges. Musashi himself started us off with the concept of a 100-floor dungeon, that would alternate between challenges, enemies, and ruin themes every several floors--you'd also be able to take breaks around certain floors descending, and even return to the surface if you so wished. The conversation eventually moved on to a whole different idea: a map maker, which would both allow more casual players to develop stock maps for fun (given that it would have plenty ease of use), and for more advanced designers to craft the map of their dreams. And the topic is: :32:Items and Special Weapons, +Ruins!:32: I will abstain from posting my opinion in full until others post their own--after all, my ideas are enough to reach the moon from here, so we don't want a total thread take-over by me. However, some brief commentary: Generally, it's fine to go into specific detail when talking about an idea for a new special weapon or item, but the focus here is on which types of equipment we'd love to see implemented in the new game, and which others should be fixed or had their prices lowered by a certain amount. We'll take our time on this one, as there is a lot of potential to be had in a discussion like this (dungeons, of course, was more straightforward). Get crackin'! |
|
|
|
Post by Raijin on Oct 2, 2010 16:21:48 GMT -5
The other speculation thread has plenty of discussion on game mechanics. Is a new thread really necessary?
|
|
|
|
Post by General Specific on Oct 2, 2010 16:27:51 GMT -5
That was a general thread about speculation. And those threads always stagnate fairly quickly, mainly because people keep stating all of their views and there isn't enough discussion of them. It's like if I just gave to you all of my ideas for MML3 right now, which just brings closure to the whole spiel. This will work better because we'll have a more focused discussion on the game, rather on various parts of the game and not just a random discussion with little center.
People do the same for plot, but never for the actual game. This is what I'm to replicate. Don't you notice the flaws of each topic I linked to for ideas? They are random discussions, and SIMSteven's thread was just his idea drop-box that people just happened to see. Now that MML3 speculation activity will be increasing, as will membership to this forum, I'm just trying to get an early start here. There's nothing inconvenient in doing this, and this thread will not be otiose as you imply.
The most I can do is pitch in with some brief commentary when I unveil the new topic--which I can do right now!
|
|
|
|
Post by Dashe on Oct 2, 2010 17:01:02 GMT -5
I hope they keep the same basic configuration as the old Playstation versions, only allow for analog stick movement. I'd also like them to keep the options for control customization on, especially the turning, since some people prefer turning with L1/R1 (including yours truly), and some prefer turning with the D-pad (or hopefully in this case, analog stick).
|
|
|
|
Post by General Specific on Oct 2, 2010 17:08:41 GMT -5
I'm going to assume that they will retain that configuration: analog stick to move, and the L/R buttons to adjust the camera. It actually works quite well, last time I played the game, but I understand why some don't approve of it or never got used to it. Having two analog sticks on a handheld would be awkward, because the 3DS would be shaking all around and you wouldn't get the best view of the top screen. The only issue with the game being on a handheld is the lack of buttons, which can greatly affect what you can do with movement.
In face of that, all of the controls from previous Legends games can definitely be translated to the 3DS. For example, you'd only have to use the stylus to access the main menu, while Start could have a different use--say it could be used to switch between special weapons, assuming that we can carry multiple special weapons in this installment. That would be an interesting compromise, and one I think I would work excellently for our situation here.
|
|
|
|
Post by Pitch on Oct 2, 2010 17:21:39 GMT -5
If the 3DS could match the PSP's controls for MegaMan Legends it would be perfect, in my opinion. (and they should be able to do that, perfectly)
Free-look gets moved to the analog stick, Lock-On is accomplished by pressing both triggers at once, and movement stays on the D-Pad. The face buttons can be matched one-to-one, so there's no headaches there, and the only thing that's left is some consideration for the touch screen and tilt-sensor. (?)
Personally, I hope the touch screen usage is minimal. The DS games I've liked the most haven't used (or had any reason to use) the touch aspect of the touch screen. It's a nifty innovation, but even having a regular second screen can be useful. Over-the-top touch screen usage isn't something I could see working in Legends, although there are some kind of cool ideas they could do. (controlling the Blade Arm with the touch screen comes to mind)
The tilt sensor (again ?) I hope is similarly ignored, or at the very least 100% optional to use. These kinds of innovations ruin the portability of games. It's not a portable game if you have somehow manage to balance the system in your hands while you simultaneously work the touch screen and the stylus (Viewtiful Joe, I'm looking at you) — nevermind if you have to hold the bloody thing at the right angle too. >.< No, thank you. But I could imagine some cool ideas for that if they really wanted to.
I just don't want innovation to get in the way of enjoying the game.
|
|
|
|
Post by General Specific on Oct 2, 2010 17:25:59 GMT -5
I figure that D-Pad could also work for free-look, but then again they should just give you the option to configure the control scheme in the Options menu any time you wish.
Touch screen usage should always be minimal, as there really isn't much you can do with it effectively other than accessing and patrolling menus, highlighting parts of a map, and just doing stuff that a stylus can already do well--we've been using them ever since the 60s. Aside from the menu, there really isn't any reason for this game to use the touch capabilities like some other titles force you to for bad reasons. Tilt is also rather silly, for reasons already explained.
What I'm going to do with the discussions in this thread is compile them all in one big document for each discussion, so that we can all have a record of this should we ever have a board reset or if this thread somehow (and it could) goes kaput. I'm trying to make a design document for how a new Legends game would play out, especially given that this is a handheld game and not on a console.
|
|
|
|
Post by Pitch on Oct 2, 2010 17:40:10 GMT -5
I'd prefer free-look/manual-aim on the Analog stick because that would give you the full range of motion, rather than the D-Pad which only gives you the four basic directions. Actual movement works on the D-Pad because you can use the L and R buttons to adjust the angle at which you're moving — classic Legends-style.
Of course, having options is always good. That way people can't complain. People will complain, of course, but they shouldn't, and you'll have every reason to completely ignore them. :32:
|
|
|
|
Post by General Specific on Oct 2, 2010 17:49:03 GMT -5
That they complain is a real knee-slapper to me. We just need to be glad that we're even getting a new installment, considering how financially successful the last two were--they weren't very successful. IDC how you set up your controls, as it just comes down to preference. What movements you can and should be able to do, however, is a whole different question. So, here's a new prompt for thinking:
Jet-packs. How would they work, how expensive and difficult would they be to find or to make, and just how effective should they really be? To start, jet-packs would ultimately have to have a set fuel limit that, while automatically-recharged as you traverse dungeons and above ground, cannot be too long as to allow the player to do everything ever with it. It would definitely be freaky expensive, and some side areas would require it to be used just to get to them. Wall-jumping would also have to be avoided in those areas, so no major wall passages that can easily be traversed with them skates.
|
|
|
|
Post by Pitch on Oct 2, 2010 18:10:16 GMT -5
The Jetpack sounds like a total game breaker, much like the Shining Laser. So I think you shouldn't be able to get it ’til the around end of the game. As for how it would handle, I think it would be best if it moved in straight lines, allowing for you to change direction — á la Cave Story. In fact, if they completely mimicked the Booster 0.8 and Booster 2.0 from Cave Story — first you can only move in one direction, then you get an upgrade that allows you to change directions midair — that would be 100% pure untainted awesome.  A fuel limit is a must. (although we don't use fuel, we use refractors!) Can't have you jetting around as much as you like, after all; that would totally break the game. x.x The idea is just zany enough for MegaMan Legends. It would be really cool. |
|
|
|
Post by General Specific on Oct 2, 2010 18:19:32 GMT -5
The fuel limit would prevent it from being a game-breaker entirely if you set it just right, and the recharge rate would be fairly low, which would promote smarter usage of the item. Shining Laser already plenty of limits, and even it wasn't a game-breaker in the sense that by the time you got it--well, that was pretty much the time you got to fight Juno or whatever boss could possibly be left to fight before going to Elysium. I was thinking Cave Story as well, and that would be just as fine. If we ever got randomly-generated dungeons, then they would not have areas that would require the Jetpack anyhow. And yeah, refractors are a no duh for us--which means that the crew would have to find a refractor small enough to fit into the jetpack, but with enough energy to power the darn thing.
But game-breaking? Not if the dungeons are designed correctly, and it would be assumed to be late-game anyways. They would also make effective last-minute safety and evasive devices against enemies, and especially against the tougher bosses and ones with great mobility.
|
|
|
|
Post by Musashi on Oct 2, 2010 19:17:02 GMT -5
I like the idea of a jetpack, I just don't know where we'd use it. Of course, that's why we design things around these sorts of ideas. Actually, the prospect of a jet pack-like item as an after game bonus would be really nifty, not only for use in the previous ruins, but also for possible side ruins that could require the use of this weapon. Really, I would love if after the game was over, there was a "Second Quest" type deal, where it's open ended but lots of new things opened up; additional ruins, additional islands, even perhaps. This would make the item more valuable and fun than just a novelty to play with after the game was over.
|
|
|
|
Post by General Specific on Oct 2, 2010 19:50:18 GMT -5
(Previously, before he edited his post, Musashi had gone off-topic on what dungeons should be like in MML3, when we were talking about jet-packs. This was my reply.)
As much as I'd love to talk about Dungeons for the new game, that isn't our current topic of discussion. I'm the one leading this discussion here, but I can make a compromise. From now on, I'll determine how long one subject should take to discuss to the point that we'll be done with it. Once we're done with movement (which we are almost), then I'll switch it to something else.
Even though I do have school, I'll still have enough time to operate this thread.
|
|
|
|
Post by Musashi on Oct 2, 2010 20:05:04 GMT -5
Fair enough, I apologize about that. I'll save the later half of my post for when the dungeons are the subject of discussion.
|
|
|
|
Post by Pitch on Oct 2, 2010 20:23:19 GMT -5
I should clarify. I want the jetpack to be a game-breaking sort of thing that you can't get until the end of the game. In fact, I'd love if you could do something to get in a “New Game+” sort of deal so you could see just how game-breaking it would be. I want it to be the most bad ass, zany piece of equipment you could imagine. I want it to be the best damn jetpack you ever saw! (If we're gonna dream, dream big, right?) |
|
