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Post by Bean on Oct 28, 2012 1:57:21 GMT -5
I'm starting this topic because of an issue that's popped up over the last week, and I find it to be a big one. I'm really getting frustrated with the whole issue of the perception of a conflict of interest in gaming journalism. It all started with this now edited article on Eurogamer discussing some situations where there may have been some impropriety issues. That article was edited by Eurogamer and caused the freelance writer to sever ties with the company ( the unedited version is here). There has been a very large thread going on at NeoGAF about this issue. When you cast yourself off as a journalist, you have to try and conduct yourself in an ethical manner. This is an issue that video games have had for years, and yet whenever it's brought up, it gets quickly shot down by some because "it's just games". I disagree. It is a business, and a billion dollar one at that. Companies are trying to use PR to influence the press. This includes parties, press kits, and even going out to eat on their dime... the kind of things that would get reporters in different fields fired for a breach of conduct. However, many games journalists soak up a good deal of these benefits thinking that there's no problem to it. Moreover, they scoff at the notion that they could be having a conflict of interest even when they find themselves friends with the companies they're trying to cover. A part of me is thinking about doing a writeup on this, but I feel like many have already said what I want to say in the NeoGAF thread. I am very annoyed at the dismissive tone some are exhibiting, the lack of responsibility from others, and even worse, the ones that feel like they're above this "non-issue". Anyway, yeah. I wanted to make a topic on it. Is it worth talking about here? It's not about a video game, but the people that cover them. Any takers for this thread?
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Post by Loken on Oct 28, 2012 13:20:11 GMT -5
I agree completely with the author of that article. What did they edit in the post afterwards?
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Post by Dashe on Oct 28, 2012 16:15:17 GMT -5
This probably has a lot to do with why gaming really went downhill in recent years. I knew I wasn't crazy!
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Post by Bean on Oct 28, 2012 18:51:24 GMT -5
I agree completely with the author of that article. What did they edit in the post afterwards? Because of the very annoying UK libel laws. This probably has a lot to do with why gaming really went downhill in recent years. I knew I wasn't crazy! To be truthful, they've somehow been more covert in recent years or maybe it's just people not even caring anymore. You can look back in mid-90s or even early 2000s magazines and see tons of photos of editors with PR people or models companies hire. That right there is a conflict of interest. Still, there are definite issues that need to be taken care of even within articles. Too many times, reviews are filled with embarrassing hyperbole that tells me nothing of the game, and it's a frustrating experience. It's just concerning when I've seen you do an interview here or there that feels more professional than the ones that are supposed to do this as their job, even though you're just a fan of the MML series. It's easy to be influenced, however, but that's the thing. You're supposed to be able to recognize that.
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Post by HF on Oct 28, 2012 19:58:34 GMT -5
Because of the very annoying UK libel laws. So is this just a case of it happening in UK, or do you have other claims you want to provide? Otherwise, ranting about this like it was some global crisis would be like spitting into the ocean; utterly meaningless, and tasteless for attacking an unrelated demographic.
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Post by Bean on Oct 28, 2012 20:10:54 GMT -5
In the article, the main topic was about the perception impropriety of journalists. It had potential examples provided from editors in the UK, but this issue is most definitely not reserved to the United Kingdom. For instance, the NeoGAF thread I posted has staff members from Kotaku coming in to defend themselves all the while someone quickly pointed out that they were helping Microsoft by advertising Halo 4 in a roundabout way with an unboxing video. Stephen Totilo, the man in the pic of the second link, is an editor over at Kotaku, and his comment disappoints me greatly. There are many more quotes in the NeoGAF thread about how journalists do not see this to be a big deal, saying that this is how it works, calling it a non-issue, wanting to take about something "more important". I think this is what makes it a big deal. The original article was good for starters, but the fallout has been nothing short of frustrating. Ethics and journalism are a big deal to me even if I'm outside of the field. Do you understand where I'm coming from now because there are plenty of examples of that perception all throughout the 5000+ post thread now.
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Post by HF on Oct 28, 2012 20:34:05 GMT -5
Do you understand where I'm coming from now because there are plenty of examples of that perception all throughout the 5000+ post thread now. So summarizing it all: Sales & Marketing of gaming by those unrelated to the gaming companies are being sell-outs by gushing about games made by the highest bidders, while at the same time challenging the integrity of these publicity actions and those directly involved in it (i.e. putting in a good word at best, and lobbying at worst). Anything else I missed?
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Post by Bean on Oct 28, 2012 20:41:04 GMT -5
Mostly, except that it's not the same people challenging the integrity that are doing the supposed shilling. It's one thing to preview a game, but in my opinion, a writer's job is to allow the PR to promote the game while you write an article about it. It's not a writer's job to do the PR work for them which is the problem here.
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Post by HF on Oct 28, 2012 21:06:23 GMT -5
Of course. So in this case, a company big-shot hire these 'sock puppets' to self-promote their image or whatever cause they support. It's almost like using alt accounts on a forum to self-promote while avoiding being shameless about it. And the latter (of what you described) would make it an easy job with the 'handy' giveaways (or even 'bribes'), and at the same time adding a layer of ambiguity to help avoid the viral marketing accusations (like the PSP case back in late 2006). On the other hand, I do not think that this argument would stand using the 'optional free loot is evil' reason alone. For one, the same can be said for magazines (using lucky draws and bundled game codes to boost sales; an example being the popular Famitsu) and collector editions* of games (i.e. paying extra for additional content; which itself may not justify the added price). * Again, this varies greatly, and should be seen on a case-by-case basis; 'collector' editions of games can range from adding an extra code for free DLC to entire encyclopedia-scale reading/visual material. In turn, the pricing differences from their normal counterparts will also greatly vary. And let's not detract ourselves from the thread by bringing up DLC ethics here.
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Post by Bean on Oct 28, 2012 21:37:58 GMT -5
Oh no, it's definitely not just about "free loot is evil". It's just that you have a guy like Geoff Keighley being used, whether he knows it or not, through a Halo 4 promotion sponsored by Mountain Dew and Doritos. The whole "tweet about us to win a PS3" thing in the original Eurogamer article is another example. It's a sketchy proposition, and I think that line between press and PR is being crossed far too often nowadays to begin with.
But it's much more than a simple "Journalists are on the take" scenario because a lot of them that could potentially be don't see the problem with it. I also think that there's room for professional relationships with PR, but there are also examples of personal ones being documented. That's the issue that is really bugging me, and the thread on NeoGAF is only reinforcing these issues.
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Post by Dashe on Oct 29, 2012 0:37:11 GMT -5
@hf - I'm seeing the problem more as game publishing houses building chummy relationships with game journalists. Not saying they can't be friends in a non-professional setting, but journalists are supposed to be an unbiased source of information as far as reviewing's concerned and all that. Like, if a game's bad, they should be the ones saying it, instead of inflating reviews on well-known or big-budget titles because they're in cahoots somehow with the publishing houses. Quality control really takes a hit when your supposed critics are hyping a product they're supposed to be critiquing, for better or worse. The marketing department in these game publishing houses should be the people doing the marketing, and the journalists should be the people honestly reflecting on whether the product they've marketed was worth the hype. Not fueling the hype themselves or biasing their verdicts based on their relationship with the publishers, whether this is their conscious intent or not. The press has to challenge the publishers, not pander to them. Goodness knows enough of them don't listen to the consumers directly. The sketchy thing about the free loot was when it was only offered to gaming press. It's fine if any Joe Schmoe off the street can pick up a free keychain and one of those Joe Schmoes happens to be a member of the press. Not so much when they're giving upwards of fifty USD worth of free loot to press only. It's just concerning when I've seen you do an interview here or there that feels more professional than the ones that are supposed to do this as their job, even though you're just a fan of the MML series. It's easy to be influenced, however, but that's the thing. You're supposed to be able to recognize that. Thanks. I'm not even that into games. I just know it's a stupid idea to blow off your consumers.
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Post by Bean on Oct 29, 2012 1:10:44 GMT -5
That's true, Dashe, but I also want to point out that it's not just free loot or obvious stuff like that the press receives here as that would make the whole matter black and white.
Say you were a member of the press. When a PR rep takes you out to a meal on his or her dime, you're already being influenced. In other journalistic fields, letting someone treat you is a big no-no. Going out for food is one thing, but a reporter is supposed to pay for their own meal. And even during those situations, while a PR person is human, they're also trying to advertise during said meal. It is their job to try and interest the press rep there in their product. It's what they do.
Sometimes they'll advertise for page space, an ad, an interview, whatever. Their end goal, even if they are being 100% friendly, is to still peddle their product or even just get their company's name out there and to the readers or viewers that could become their customers. I'm sure we've all fallen for at some point an ad for a movie, car, television show, game, toy, or anything of the like just by a simple commercial especially since most of us are children of the 80s and 90s when this took off. We're easily influenced (going back to my psychology studies), but that's fine. It's just that we need the press to make a firm line of not falling prey to the same things customers do. Unfortunately in gaming, that doesn't seem to happen as much.
Man, I'm really interested in this topic. I won't apologize for the long paragraphs, but thanks to you all for reading and sharing your viewpoints on the matter. I love this kind of discussion.
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Post by Dashe on Oct 29, 2012 1:30:39 GMT -5
Right. These gaming journalists need to buck up and make the PR reps have to really work to sell them on their game. And hopefully that'll push publishers to publish genuinely good games and take the kinds of risks that'll advance the industry instead of consistently taking the easy way out and blowing giant budgets on forty-hour movies and the tried-n-true Same Old Stuff formula. There's a problem when the press are as easily influenced as regular consumers. Semi-related, when I was in choir, the director had us warm up to "Buy a Toyota" and it still has me wondering, more than ten years later, whether he'd struck some kind of deal with the company or not. Most vocal warm-ups are sol fege or nonsense syllables, so it stuck out more than usual. I may not be driving a Toyota now, but the fact that it's still stuck in my head is pretty telling. So the commentary about hashtags not counting as an ad? Please. If a vocal warm-up can function as an ad, then a hashtag qualifies too. And don't apologize for the long paragraphs. They're full of engaging content. That's the best kind of paragraph out there. I just have an uncanny ability to summarize things without really trying.
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Post by Bean on Oct 29, 2012 1:36:28 GMT -5
Exactly! Just a song can even get our brains wired to it, even if it's a negative influence kind of way. This is going off-base from the original topic for a bit, but I remember when Cartoon Network in 2000 would not stop showing that dang ad for The Powerpuff Girls movie. It was on twice during nearly every break for a good couple of weeks. I was so sick of it, yet sure enough, that commercial still pops up every now and then in my head even to this day with the song playing. That's how easy it is to be taken in by something. To think that we're magically immune to advertising of any form is dismissive, and it's kind of the tone I'm seeing in that now 109 page thread. I wouldn't ask you all to read the whole thing, but here's a summary post of the good parts. It's also in the first post, but this just links you right to it.
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Post by HF on Oct 29, 2012 1:43:42 GMT -5
From a superficial perspective, perhaps. Though I can see how cultural differences can play a big part in this.
Think about this: While unethical to 'bribe' your way to gain favor from a journalist, it would be downright rude to decline it under most circumstances. In such a case, nobody wins. This is especially so for individual journalists without some 'cover' such as a company policy to justify themselves.
In the same sense as gift-giving as a token of good relations (also known as "Hak Hei" and "Ke qi" in Hong Kong and China; both which translates literally to guest's atmosphere), different cultures would react differently to the concept of it. With this in mind, it would be foolish to be 'already be influenced' by just a superficial gesture alone, otherwise you would have failed as a journalist (and at worst, as a person). Which is why despite all the peddling and gift-giving the East has been portrayed to take part in regularly, it is still a hard-fought battle of willpower and endurance that keeps things working instead of falling into a disastrous PR mess.
This is also why even though I constantly question the inefficient methods that stereotypical Japanese companies implement, I still hold a great respect for the workers' work ethic and workmanship as engineers of their culture and many subcultures.
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