Critically assessing topic!

[yui]

What are some video games that you used to like or love, but looking back on it nowadays, you don't anymore? Whether you just grew out of that type of game, or you now see things that make the game not fun anymore, any reason at all is okay. If you don't know why you don't like something, then we can discuss it and maybe figure it out! Maybe you still love the game, but you want to critically explore and discuss it. How would you fix something that broke the game for you?

Remember that this could get very opinionated, and there's pros and cons to that. If we're cooperative, we can help hone each others taste in genre, themes, and style. Negatively, we can get our feelings tied up protecting a game over said opinion. This is just a reminder ahead of time, to keep our heads in the game, haha!

If I could start, I really, really loved The Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker, and thematically it's probably the closest I can think of that embodies that same sense of adventure I got when I first played MML. However I can't ever succeed in playing it again, because the amount of time spent waiting to actually adventure, slows the pace down dramatically. This is probably why are lot of fans wanted a Zelda MMO after WW, because there was so much to explore, but if you wanted to keep exploring after completing the game, you had to go through the story again.
How I would fix it, though, is simply to add an arcade type quick play option after the story. Anyone could jump in and go straight to whatever they want, provided they could, just like in the original Zelda.

Ehwhe, this could be a hard topic, but I've put all this effort in now, so I might as well post it. I look forward to replies! 0u0

[Dashe]

That sounds like how I feel about every video game besides Mega Man Legends.

I'm completely floored by how crappy the English translations are for a lot of games out there. If I were in charge of localizing any of them there would be zero typos and all of the sentences in the games would be structured in a way that makes sense.

The Zelda series definitely has fallen into a rut, I'd say. Going into a new one used to bring about a sense of mystery with it, and it was fun discovering the cool new items in every dungeon...but at least as far as the handhelds are concerned, most of the slots are already filled up by the staples--bombs, the bow and/or boomerang, something like the hookshot, something like the megaton hammer, and your sword and shield. I don't think Phantom Hourglass had even one original item. A lot of similar games have very theme-y dungeons. I mean, you go into pretty much any game with dungeons or levels and you know you're going to have lava, water, plants, and ice in there somewhere. Usually not all at once. It gets old after a while.

[yui]

Oh wow, I had seen that in a discussion about Legends 2, the elemental part. I started seeing it in a lot of games, but I just now realized that it was even in Spelunky, a game I've found I love to death lately! Every four stages the theme changes, and guess what they are? It did incorporate that very well though, and while I don't want to play it much anymore, I can't think of any real reason it pushes me away.

[Dashe]

If you've seen that in a discussion about Legends 2, there's a very good chance that I was involved in that discussion. I'm running through Pandora's Tower now and it incorporates the elemental themes pretty well--water, fire, plants, and they stuck in earth and metal instead of ice. They made it into some civilization's religion. I mean, the game really just feels like a hookshot-based Zelda that's pretty much all gameplay, but it's solid enough and you've gotta give them a few points for originality as far as the structure of the quest is concerned. Pandora's Tower was the last game I paid money for, and that was just to help out Operation Rainfall, so yeah, it's been a while since I've been hyped for anything.

[yui]

The are a few kickstarter games I'm hyped for. Firstly there's Sealark, which is like a metroid fishing rpg, from what I gather. It looks beautiful, and has that ocean setting it love so much.
Radio the Universe is supposedly shooting for this winter as well, and it's like sci fi 2d Zelda plus ikaruga.

I'm not sure what I like in games anymore. (-_-;

[HF]

As Dashe has mentioned, games which allow you to take your time and quite literally immerse yourself into has become difficult to get into due to time constraints for various reasons such as work, hobbies, and other social obligations. Though in this case, it is not about being unable to enjoy them out of lack of interest, but simply lack of time to dedicate to playing and actually getting yourself lost into it. To my memory, the last big adventure game (on console) I did play before I started non-freelance employment job was Zelda Skyward Sword, and it was a blast.

While I still find opportunities to (re)play classics or hardcore adventure games thanks to portable releases (such as RMD 1/2 for PSP, Zelda Ocarina of Time, and Link Between Worlds for 3DS) during transit, I cannot quite say the same for long RPGs such as the Final Fantasy series which never made it to portable releases. Though I also managed to play a couple of first-person shooters and fighting games here and there, those were mostly for social purposes (not to be mistaken for the common idea of "social gaming", of course).

So yui, if you played Ikaruga (which I enjoyed plenty), have you played any of the Gradius games? Personally, the fun factor is that they're easy to pick-up-and-play but have such a high skill ceiling that you'll enjoy the challenge on each playthrough.

[yui]

I love Gradius! I couldn't begin to tell you the moments I've had playing it with my friends. It's still kicked my butt all these times though, I've never been able to finish it without continues. orz
That reminds me, in the early 90s, some Konami staff left to form their own company called Treasure. Treasure makes really unique games, and I like how much action they still have. One of my favorites is Silhouette Mirage, on PS1, it's got that ikaruga bullet duality, but is a platformer like megaman. The only real complaint I have would be that the English localization attempted to make the difficulty harder by increasing the amount of grinding for money to get weapons.

But if you overlook that, it's an awesome title to play, and has multiple endings to an interesting and strange story.

[Dashe]

I thought I was the only one who played Silhouette Mirage! That was a really hard game. I haven't beaten it even once and I think I may have accidentally stolen it from my cousin. Technically, he swapped it for Woody Woodpecker Racing, so yeah, it was pretty much stealing.

[yui]

Funnily enough, I lent mine out in junior high, and my friend returned the case but forgot the disc! This game likes to roam, I bet. Travel like gemstones, haha.
I always wished more people had played it, but nobody seemed to like it.

[MegaTuga]

hm. Interesting topic. I guess for me it would be... Sonic? My very first console was a Master System II with Sonic the Hedgehog built-in. (I was amazed at the single fact that the console had a game built-in at the time). And I played the hell out of it. I can still remember most of the stages by memory and I could probably still play it semi-flawlessly (except that dang underwater stage and Boss... Grrr). Heck I even remember most of the locations of the Chaos Emeralds (and again, I was amazed by the fact that the game had different endings). Long story short. It was my biggest entertainment when I was a kid.

Now... I don't understand Sonic games much. They are bright and colorful but completely different from the game I used to love. I like how the new games are very modern and with excellent gameplay (I never played any of the modern games though) emphasizing on speed, just like old times. But the jump to 3D made the game... weird? I played Sonic Rush and Rush adventure and I liked the boss battles in those games. But when you make the whole game in that perspective... I just can't get it. And then the new game Lost Worlds... No. Just no. They were slowly ruining the franchise for me but this one takes the prize for the most "what were you thinking" game.


Oh and Gaia Online/Zomg! The battle system was still dull point-and-click to walk, inspect attack, always leaving you no margin to dodge. But at least the gameplay was nice, not enforcing levels and equipment but Ring strength. If it wasn't for the click-click-click battle style I would never drop it.

[yui]

Sonic could benefit a lot from Sega getting off drugs. I played through Sonic 2 on the Genesis (I think? I've never owned a Sega) with a friend and that was a fun experience, it controlled well, and that only time we had to slow down was underwater, but between you and I, Sonic should just avoid swimming. My first Sonic game ever was Adventure 2 Battle, which I love, but admittedly, 3d Sonic is weird, the pace slows down when you want to go fast, because people still don't know how to make Sonic 3d. It's in such trouble, the only way I could think of fixing it is to make a new IP. Keep sonic 2d, use a new IP for these 3d games they want to desperately make.

[Mikéy]

Somewhat related, I guess:



(Might be a bit NSFW in some areas. MattPatt's like that.)

If there's any sort of critical analysis you want, Game Theory's probably one of the best things to look up on Youtube. New stuff weekly.

[yui]

I love Game Theory, Egoraptor and JonTron. They all give me great insight to gaming critique. But I also understand that games have changed with the times and there are new generations to market to. I want to evolve with with the market, but the one key element that I think I'd the best thing a developer can do is to add options. You can build a game however you want, but the key to making it better is to give players as many choices as possible.

[Dashe]

Factoring a game's age into your judgment or not can get iffy. Some games hold up well better than others, and it's really telling if an installment of a game from twenty years ago ends up being altogether more well-thought out and well-executed than an installment from two years ago. Still, in a lot of instances, it's tough to set a definitive bar for whether a really old game is any good when you don't know your audience. I keep hearing good things about the old Ultimas from people who are either a lot older than I am or were stuck with really old, crusty computers when they were kids, but when I tried to play one myself I couldn't intuitively figure out what to type in the text input or figure out a good chunk of the controls at all. I suppose these games must have been from a time when not everyone had access to even a mouse. Just because a game was enjoyable when nobody had a mouse doesn't mean that it holds up in a world where touch controls are practically ubiquitous.

I mean, I'm not exactly one of those people who fondly looks back on times of technological hardship with fondness or anything. "Gee, I sure miss using my old Apple Macintosh and dot matrix printer!" isn't a thought that crosses my mind a lot. That computer was outdated before I was even born and the basement had Windows 95, so someone who goes in used to dealing with a much newer interface is pretty likely to get frustrated at an older one. Everyone's hard line as to what "unplayable" or "frustratingly primitive" constitutes probably varies. I didn't get into gaming until 1998, but 16-bit with a standard controller or at least a mouse seems to be my baseline. I always thought this was a really generous baseline but I still get flack from NES junkies on it a lot.

[yui]

From my perspective, it's not a matter of whether a game is fun, but it's what makes it fun. In their times, they were popular for a reason, so then I should look for how they succeed. Then see if that is applicable now, and if so, utilise it. Success is success, even if you evolve it to fit a new generation.