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Post by jeffdamann on Jul 7, 2011 2:10:59 GMT -5
Hi all. I have searched endlessly to mod my favorite game, Megaman Legends, and am disturbed of the lack of mod community support. Therefore I have made it my personal mission to mod this game, and gather data so that others can do the same. Of course anyone who mods this game will have their own focus, but I want to keep the game original. I just want to update the graphics and models, and video renderer. I have successfully extracted and decoded the information within the game. However, I have no way as of this very second to rebundle the files I have edited to their original format. I offer proof of my texture extraction: If anyone would like to become active with me in this, and do great things for this game, I tell you it will not be hard. Final Fantasy 7 is much harder trust me, and I am already a member of a FF7 modding community. I hope I have raised some interest, and want you to know that I will be actively pursuing the graphical improvement for this game for the unforeseeable future. I will post all my findings here for everyone to see and participate. EDIT: Here is some nice video I made using the Advanced cartoon shader in epsxe with a lot of AA/Anisotropy. Hope you like it
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Qwertman
Habarool
Work work work...
Posts: 736
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Post by Qwertman on Jul 7, 2011 8:41:38 GMT -5
This is old news to anybody who's been around for a while. Everybody tries to start their own mod of Legends with better graphics etc. in some way or another, but it always ends up being too massive a project for them to finish. If you're really brave enough and think you can do it, you'll need a Playstation 1 SDK (software developer's kit) in order to re-compile the game. I did a little bit of searching and according to Razor Blade on the ngemu forums
EDIT: Didn't spend the time to notice you were talking about the PC version.
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Post by jeffdamann on Jul 7, 2011 9:24:53 GMT -5
Sorry, but I have to disagree with you. The quote you listed says "It just cant be done on PC" That is laughable.
Actually the realm of fact lays in the contrary. Psx titles leave little room for change. Trust me, Ive been down this road with FF7 PC and PSX. While we have hundreds of new models and textures and fixes in the PC version, We can only edit simple enemy AI data/ replace textures with other textures of the exact same size, useless.
I can run FF7 at 1920x1080(or higher if I wished) with a Full set of custom models, textures, AI fixes, menu fixes, mechanic fixes, and the like.
This can very much be done with legends. I invite you to search around and find someone extracting textures from the pc version. I myself have looked for two weeks. Have seen no proof of this having ever been done.
Im on the verge of a breakthrough. I have modified some textures upscaling them 8-16x and the COMPLETELTY redoing the entire texture map by hand. All I have to do is write an exporter from PNG to TM(texture map) and then insert the TM into the bin and voila.
Here's some of my work...
Before my work. Go to 5:15 and watch the battle.
Behold, Ps2+ graphics!(Watch in 720p)
New enemies!
So please dont come in here telling me its a pipe dream, or that Im unable to do it.
I love megaman legends, and through weeks of searching and lurking these forums, have grown to like the community here. I would like to help the game out in all possible ways. My work will draw interest from other skilled individuals over time, and megaman legends pc will grow along the way.
I would like to reiterate. Megaman Legends psx or 64 HAVE SEVERE LIMITATIONS! The PC COPY is the ONLY viable source material to work with, save maybe the music from the psx version, because Im sure everyone hates those non-looping wavs.
Also I just started bitcoining after looking at your post, and Im getting around 1.5 Ghash/sec Is that good?
I have 4 6970's BTW
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Trege
Poh
oro?
Meddling with Legends 1, Legends 2 and Mega Man 64 data.
Posts: 463
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Post by Trege on Jul 7, 2011 10:50:20 GMT -5
Qwertman Actually the fact that it's on PC means it's easier to mod then just having it on PSX, not only can you edit files by extracting bins but you can also use an amount of ways to edit the game using bin editors and ISO editors and various PSX tools throughout modding communities such as zophers domain which give you access to the games files though figuring out how to use them is a different story, judging by his work I think he knows what he's doing so far and if you ever could decompile the Data on the PC version itself then everyone could use it. (Are you using an ISO or the actual PC version of the game?) Also anything on a PC can be edited if you know how to use it.
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Post by jeffdamann on Jul 7, 2011 10:59:51 GMT -5
Im using the actual game cd. I have both legends 1 and 2 for pc I will post any updates when I get some work done, right now its 11:00 am, and I didnt sleep last night so.. Ciao!
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Post by Chiz on Jul 7, 2011 15:15:30 GMT -5
I'm going to play skeptic here, because I'd like to think I'm a little qualified at taking on the role. MML1 PC TM extraction is trivial, to the point that tools have existed for sometime in doing so. This is pretty much the only thing these, or any, tools do, simply because it is easy (relatively speaking - naturally you can't be scared of a hex editor to look into the BINs to find the things if you're working from scratch). The only other MML-related thing you posted was playing with a graphic filter, on a graphic plugin on ePSXe - not only is this not the PC version (obviously), but this very same graphic filter that I've seen a few people posting videos/screenshots use over the last month or two. The FF7 PC "Higher Res" content, while admittedly is a step up, can be created by the large number of tools that the FF7 community has produced. They are much more dedicated to documenting and reverse engineering the PC version than we are; in fact, in MML2/DASH2's case, it was uncertain that the PC version even existed until a few years ago when a few members, including myself, managed to stumble on some copies of them. Don't get me wrong - I would LOVE help in breaking these games down and documenting them - but from what I've seen, I remain unconvinced of your technical prowess. As someone who has spent roughly 2 years hacking DASH2PC, I can assure you that there is no longer a wealth of low-hanging fruit to pick. At this point, it's almost all about figuring out the custom binary model formats and so on.
A little assistance for you, which you should know by now (I don't do MML1PC much, but have touched upon it and it is on my to-do list; DASH2PC just takes priority 'cause it's a much better engine): There's 4 formats in MML1 PC. 'BD', 'CT', 'TM', and "WB'; WB is Wave Bank (audio), TM is Texture Map (textures); I believe CT is Colour Table (palette) and BD would be Binary Data (pretty much everything else). Breaking apart BDs should be your main focus. The BIN container format is complete (to my knowledge), and I wrote an extraction tool some weeks (months?) ago to expedite work. No promises this thing will work every time. EDIT: For the record, WBK is 100% complete too, although BINext won't handle it. (I have a separate tool for it). EDIT2: If you just want a high resolution version of MML, I definitely recommend just using the N64 version; There's several graphical plugins that allow dumping and replacing textures on the fly. EDIT3: On second thought, I'm pulling BINext down. You apparently already have tools other people made to split BINs. EDIT4: If you're still offering that computer equipment, I'll claim it right now, 'cause a lot of the basic work you're asking for is already done by me. I'm not sure I really approve of your "[MML] sucks" but I'm poor and will always welcome goodies.
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Post by jeffdamann on Jul 7, 2011 19:57:55 GMT -5
You misunderstand. Just try and find a tool that does what I have done to FF7, none exist. You have to edit the hex in the exe, as well as know a little assembly. Maybe since Aali(assembly master) made the modified graphics plugin, things got a bit easier. My personal work includes, but is not limited to, the menu changes you see in my vids, a lot of battle-backgrounds. Some model textures. Also you said TM extraction is old news. Please point me to anywhere on the internet this has been done before. I have to say, I feel a bit of animosity coming from the community. I will say that it sort of destroys my drive for working on this. I have put in countless hours reading hex, searching for information, etc. All for the benefit of the MML community. You guys seem to hold the same kind of love for the game as I do. Here is a link to the FF7 modding forum, we are the only one, and I have done MANY things, just search around for proof of my work. forums.qhimm.comI am also a developer for Q-GEARS(we are rebuilding a FF7-8-9 engine from OGRE) As far as the epsxe video, I clearly stated in my posts that Im only interested in MML:PC, and that it was just a fun look at epsxe with the cartoon shader, because unlike you, Ive only seen like 2 pictures from it, and no videos Once again Im not sure if I like the animosity, or should I say... a slight level of contempt? I do not feel welcomed. Is that the case? I can disappear as quickly as I apppeared you know. EDIT: Didnt see your text under the ______________ line. I feel less animosity from those posts, sorry Im bipolar and I take things too seriously sometimes. And it would seem your an active member of overclock.net or else you searched for megaman pc after I made the topics.(Actually the topic you refer to doesnt even mention it in the title, so you should be an active member.) Of course the offer is up to anyone who wants it. Im a horrible coder, and I need help with some things. Please do not misunderstand me, Im not some headstrong teenager. Im 24 years old with a wife and a kid.I am dedicated to my work. I get things done.MML2 may have a better engine, but so does FF9 over 8 and 7. Yet here arises the problem. With a more complex engine, things get harder to understand and edit. You yourself seem to have done a lot in the way of modding the game. I would be happy to collaborate with you so that we can get something done. Please understand though, I am not interested in looking at MML2 until some serious work has been done to MML, thats just the correct path in my opinion. You know how the data is arranged. I mean look at it. With "LITTLE" technical mod community support, we could change this game inside and out if we wanted.
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Post by Dashe on Jul 7, 2011 20:11:00 GMT -5
If you want to feel welcomed, you could introduce yourself in Rules & Introductions with a welcome thread. Perhaps engage in some discussion about the game as well, aside from just, you know, getting down to business to defeat the Huns. You'd be surprised how far just taking the time to introduce yourself to the community can go to help you fit in faster. I'd have posted something here earlier, but I am probably the absolute least tech-savvy person on these boards, so anything I could have possibly posted here up until this point would technically be irrelevant.
I'd like to see this project succeed, but I really don't have any of the skills to assess its doability or to help with it. Chiz and the rest of the guys can vouch for that.
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Post by jeffdamann on Jul 7, 2011 20:24:20 GMT -5
Thanks, I will do that, but I have never been one for theoretical talk. I like to get down to business. I wanted to make my first post with a video of a completely redone Ocean Ruin, But I ran into trouble and figured other tech-savvy individuals would gain interest and like to join my efforts. I am BY NO MEANS a technical genuis. I am a horrible coder, I barely understand assembly, but one thing I have is drive and determination. Ill head over and introduce myself. Thanks for your kind post, you make me feel more welcome, but after this, lets keep this thread open for MML modding purposes. We'll talk more in unrelated/ whatever section I post in. Also, when I said [MML] sucks, I meant what the devs did to it sucks. The game itself is a never-ending pot of gold. The execution however, leaves much to be desired. EDIT: Don't get me wrong - I would LOVE help in breaking these games down and documenting them - but from what I've seen, I remain unconvinced of your technical prowess. As someone who has spent roughly 2 years hacking DASH2PC, I can assure you that there is no longer a wealth of low-hanging fruit to pick. At this point, it's almost all about figuring out the custom binary model formats and so on. So your telling me as of right this second its is VERY EASY to stick in custom models and textures? All thats left is figuring out the binary model? If so why hasnt anyone done it. More so, If thats the case, please give me a guiding hand and I can have a completely redone Ocean Ruins by next week. Including ALL TEXTURES that are shown in that mission, along with some Rockman and Reaverbot and treasure chest modeling work.
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Post by Chiz on Jul 7, 2011 21:37:39 GMT -5
So your telling me as of right this second its is VERY EASY to stick in custom models and textures? All thats left is figuring out the binary model? For the most part. I've already done texture swaps/replacements with DASH2PC, and I can't see the models being any harder. The problem is that I can't convert between the DASH2PC custom format (no tools exist; I need to make my own) and a common format (like OBJ). If so why hasnt anyone done it. I'm basically the only person working on reverse engineering these games at this time. I have zero help in the critical 'mod-centric' fields, like documenting these files formats, so it's a VERY slow process. I've also got a very poor attention span and have a number of other projects on the go (like the big enhancement script for this forum, 'Terraformer'). Trust me, if it were as simple as "swapping in a new file", I'd've done it by now. More so, If thats the case, please give me a guiding hand and I can have a completely redone Ocean Ruins by next week. Including ALL TEXTURES that are shown in that mission, along with some Rockman and Reaverbot and treasure chest modeling work. I personally think your goals are incredibly unrealistic, considering the state of MML1PC. While obviously I can't say how MML1PC works, I do know that for the 2nd game, simply inserting a higher quality texture won't work; the UV maps are resolution dependent (requires access to model data), the textures are very low-colour (to the extent that your TM to PNG conversion posted above is a bad rip because it assumes 256-colour instead of 16-colour, which it actually is!), the game only allocating so much RAM for an image (necessitating the exact same resolution, unless you shift around memory locations too), you need to change miscellaneous references in the game to point to the new location and length of the data, etc etc etc. "Next Week" is for someone who has tools, not someone who doesn't even have the documentation to write tools. Ultimately, I'm rather far along with the 2nd game and I'm not prepared to stop to work on MML1 full time. I'm willing to examine and comment on any work you do, but I think I'm too close to another breakthrough on the 2nd game to stop now. Sorry. PS: This might seem like an odd request, but you said you had a copy of Legends 2 for PC on disc. Do you think you could post a couple photos of the CD?
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Post by jeffdamann on Jul 7, 2011 22:27:28 GMT -5
Odd, I could have swore I already replied...
I would love to collaborate with you, Ive searched endlessly and worked tirelessly to try and make something come of this. You obviously know a lot more about what is going on than me.
Do you have any documentation that you would like to share on your findings? Right now I have a friend of mine that is a wizard of savemaps preparing to look at how mml handles its savemap, and what the data actually means(he could easily whip up a save hacker this way)Im trying very hard to get things done with from my end, but as I said, I am by no means the most technical person, a horrible coder, and I barely understand assembly.
Would it not be beneficial to post a guide on what you know and what techniques you use? Information like that is invaluable when it come to a game like this.
Of course Ill post a pic, let me get my hands on a camera(I dont go out very much, therefore, I have a lot of time to spend on "projects" like this)
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Post by Chiz on Jul 7, 2011 23:20:11 GMT -5
Do you have any documentation that you would like to share on your findings? The only documentation, MML1PC-wise, that I have is the container/header format for the .BIN and the .WBK files. Anyone who can casually program in any all-purpose language can make use of the information to create an extractor, and by extension, a tool that can recompile a .BIN or .WBK (WaveBanK, not WorkBooK; it's custom) from loose files. Would it not be beneficial to post a guide on what you know and what techniques you use? Information like that is invaluable when it come to a game like this. I've only got 2 strats I follow...1, is that pretty much all of the headers for the various formats are minimalistic; just a series of pointers and locations on where to go for the goods. The same types of arranging data keep coming up, meaning once you've solved a few of their tricks, it gets easier (you can just keep referring to old answers and old solutions to new problems); 2, in the cases where something doesn't make sense, sleep on it. You might have a revelation on what that data/those numbers mean, and how they can fit into the larger puzzle. As a 3rd bonus strat, organize everything properly. Back when I started in 2009, I was saving notes and such in TXT files strewn across various folders...I lost a lot of that because I wasn't organized and had to duplicate work (most of the recovered information actually comes from interpreting the source code of small tools I wrote back then, not those TXT files, which are still mostly lost). When I started getting serious about the project again, I set up my own personal Wiki just so that I'd be organized, have all my notes in the same place, and can keep a record of my edits and progression. The fact that it also handles images is a bonus.
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Post by jeffdamann on Jul 7, 2011 23:28:23 GMT -5
OMGZ! You deserve to be station gaurdian.
Thank you for such useful information! This gives me a little something to go on. Let me see what I can do with all this
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Post by Chiz on Jul 8, 2011 1:08:11 GMT -5
I took a minor glance at the RMD1PC .CT and .TM ( :37: ), and they're almost 1:1 of the RMD2PC x03 and x04, so I'll just write up pages for those and post copies in this post once I'm done.
But that's it...! :01:
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Post by jeffdamann on Jul 8, 2011 3:49:19 GMT -5
I wake up hungry in the middle of the night and find this? Genius? Were gonna get some stuff done here. I can feel it.
I will get started tomorrow learning the ins and outs of how these files work. Thanks again so much.
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