Sigma and Legends!!

[S K Y]

Okay I was watching an excellent megaman flash the other day and while it was loading it had a picture of X,Zero, and Sigma close up on the screen.

These were cool pics so as I was looking i noticed Sigmas forehead.

I cant find any pics of Sigma close up(if you can find any please contact me:IM,PM,POST IT EHRE,etc) so I cant really show what Im talking about , BUT, there is a gem on his forehead which I noticed in both the X 7 Sigma and whichever one was in the flash.

That gem is the exact same thing as the sign for legends 2.


DISCUSS PLEASE.

[GustaffGlyde]

Well, its pretty much official that the X series is indeed linked to the Legends series, but that symbol has nothing to do with it. I'll admit that when I first saw a picture of Sigma's head my first thought was, "Wha? Sigma has the system symbol... I wonder". Actually, although similar, it is not the same symbol.

Grrrr... the original site from which I got Sigma pictures had a tracker cookie, so I've found some more pics which are safer, somewhat better, and in... Spanish. Links below
The Site:
www.megamanchile.net/megax6.htm
Pic one. Shady Sigma:
www.megamanchile.net/Images/intro-6.jpg
Pic two. Side view of Sigma:
www.megamanchile.net/Images/tgs320-4.jpg
Pic three. ummm...
www.megamanchile.net/Images/intro-7.jpg

Admittably it does look like it, but all in all its just a fancy decoration to draw your attention away from his bald head and make him look cool. poor fellow. Its simply a gem set into a piece o metal which has the three rays extending from to keep it attached to his head.

If I could find out what the actual Master System Symbol was, I could do some research on it. I went through an archive of symbols and couldn't find that symbol. My guess is that it is a variation on the old circle with a dot symbol (can't remeber the name). The spikes on it are probably just for decoration. Here are several similar symbols


This sign is related to the idea of the sun as the center and the source of light and energy.



This sign, or a similar one with more concentric circles, is often found on Nordic rock carvings. It has also been found on cliff paintings in the Sahara and other places. This symbol is similar sign Adinkirahane used on clothes in Ghana, means the highest, the best, or the king.

In other words, even if it was the same, its just a symbol used to represent his power, or try to draw attention away from his bald head. Its probably just a decoration though. Also, you can see by these symbol's meanings how they could be used for the Master System symbol. Still, this is just a guess about what the symbol could be based on.

Also, though this isn't relevant, why is the symbol on Juno different from the symbol used in the second game. It could mean something, or it could just be a change in the design tastes. Still, if I could figure out the symbols used in the game it would help explain and clear up some of the questions and expand on the story... or maybe I'm just being weird.

In closing, Sigma and the Master System sybmol probably aren't linked. Still, you never know.

All info on symbols came from:
www.symbols.com/index.html

[S K Y]

Those pics wouldnt come up but if you meant that what I was talking about was the traditional Black dot in a red circle.

No.

both symbols were the same other than the outisde color.

But I never found any relation between the two series.

In the journal of Barell it says that megaman was named by Roll got the name from a popular video game series.(Rockman)

Rockman and X are related.

But in the legends world it said that megman/rockman is a video game series.

So X and Rockman being related means their both video games in the legends world.

Where did it say that the were linked other than that?

Not meaning to argue just asking.

[GustaffGlyde]

Cursed stupid pictures how dare they disobey me... Got rid of the old evil pictures and posted new and better pictures. I noticed in the new pictures, Sigma has only 3 rays on his symbol, but in the old pictures he had four rays. Although I don't trust the site that they came from, the old pictures themselves were screenshots. I think that its just a Capcom style of drawing. Sorry for not researching those links. Anyways, now that I have trustworthy pictures I can see what you mean. It looks like the symbol. Still, I don't think there is really anything to it, though now that I've noticed the different number of rays between games it makes me wonder. Maybe at first it was just a decoration, but then they decided to link the series together in a hope that fans of one series would then buy the other series. Because of this, they changed Sigma's fore head decoration to resemble the Master system symbol. This provided a kind of link between the series. Still, I don't know.

Also, I wasn't actually talking about the circle with a dot, just that I think they may have derived the symbol from that by adding the triangular points (I have a theory on what the points mean, but I'm just going to say that they're for decoration for now).

Now, as for the relation, the games are chronologically linked.
Classic, X series, Zero series, Legends.
It does say this somewhere, but I'm not sure where exactly. Its in a Capcom book I think. When/if SIMSteven or Feldinaut come by, they'll probably be able to tell you exactly where that info comes from. Also, they had a thread similar to this at the MMLU Boards some time ago.
superdanny.proboards16.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=Talk10&thread=1062526630&start=0
There they just theorized that it was a Capsom symbol that they absentmindedly reused. Still, its for you to decide.

[SIMSteven]

That book is called Rockman Perfect Works and has been released by Capcom. It states,

"MegaMan Legends takes place several thousand years after the X series."

The book was released a couple years ago and only in Japan. There was a guy at GameFAQs that either translated it himself or had a friend do it. The whole point, though, is that they are related.

Anywas, I think I was the one to create the topic at MLU. I think that Sigma just has the symbol as a cool decal and nothing more. And besides, Sigma was good at one time, so does it really even matter if there is a relation?

[S K Y]

I just thought that if Capcom meant to use that symbol on purpose and if Legends took place thousands of years after the X series then I thought Sigma might have been an ancestor of the anciets.

Because Matilda at the beginning of legends 2 has that symbol on a bracelet which she holds up in the air.

But my question has been answered.

[WoodleDiaper]

I believe the popular theory is that since the System created history for the carbons, the name "Megaman" was in their history and had a major influence on it, so they decided to make video games and comic books and such about megaman's real life adventures.

That makes sense, right?

[SIMSteven]

BTW, that symbol in the first post looks AWFULLY familiar. In fact, I think I was the one who made it.

I put it on my web site and said it was free though, so I shouldn't be complaining. The original is MUCH larger, though.

[JMC47]

I also know that that is the symbol on yuna's bracelet at the beginning of legends 2. I just watched the opening cutscene to make sure.

[SIMSteven]

It's also on Sera's bracelets, so it more or less stands for "Mother Unit."

At least, that's what it's theorized to be.

[JMC47]

It probably has something more or less to do with followers of the system, rather than just the mother units, but I'm probably wrong.

[fAB]

SIMSteven said:

BTW, that symbol in the first post looks AWFULLY familiar. In fact, I think I was the one who made it.

I put it on my web site and said it was free though, so I shouldn't be complaining. The original is MUCH larger, though.

Nope, sorry, that one's mine, original.


I've only had a moment to quickly glance at this topic, but it's kind of interesting... I haven't touched the X series since X5, so I'm behind on a lot of these things that link to the Legends world. However, it's hard to take such links as having any real meaning, as the X series was supposed to have ended with X5, according to Inafune. So, anything after that is rather like, not originally intended by the Mega Man master himself...

[JMC47]

I stopped playing the X series with 3, It just got to repetitive. You probably would find that symbol on the paintjobs of some of the reaverbots, or in the walls of the ruins, it may of also been on the refractor pedestal(this is a wild guess, but don't the keys in legends 2 have something like that on them, I'll check soon)

[GustaffGlyde]

... And almost a month later (why am I even bothering?), I have finally found (accidentally…) a site which hosts a lot of pictures, and some which include Sigma from the X series. Yeah, I don’t think anyone still cares, but I have nothing better to do… I have no life! *runs off and cries for an hour*.

Well, I’m better now. I still don’t think there is a relation based solely on the design of the symbol, and this is because the design of the decoration constantly changes. I’ll provide pictures later.

First, since the subject of a relation that runs deeper than just a chronological tie seems to intrigue some, I’ll provide some stuff that may hint at Sigma providing the basis of what would become the system. All right, first off is that it appeared that a lot of the good and bad guys lived in underground fortresses, much like the ruins in Legends, and Sigma even created a satellite. It may have been destroyed, but it could be a predecessor for the later Eden satellites. Also, a lot of the characters have designs similar to the few examples of enemies found in Legends (Juno and co.). Still, this is just a theory.

Now, we probably have the most infamous link between the series, X’s speech at the end of MMX5. As fab said, this was planned to be the last game originally, and considering this is what X says at the end… well, you get the idea. Well, here goes…

Hunter B (talking to X): “What is your private Dream”

X: “Huh?... I’ve never thought about it… Well… I’ve got it! I want to create ”Elysium”.”

Hunter A and B: “Elysium… ?”

X: “Yes! It’s a paradise where the human race coexist with reploids peacefully…Yes… That is my dream… I’d like to create “Elysium”… Someday in the near future…”

Hunters: Random talk about Zero and such…

X: “ “Elysium”… Oh, yes… I’ll do it someday…”

Now, what does that have to do with Sigma… I’m getting there. In Legends, they mention that for the Master System (Elysium) to be created, the Elder System and its people had to be destroyed. If X had a hand in making Elysium, the Elder System could have to do with Sigma and the mavericks. I’ve also thought that Neo-Arcadia might have been the Elder System and Zero and co. established the Master System, but the Zero series is something new, which means that it probably wasn’t in the original time line (it is in the new one though). This makes me think that X and hunters = Master System and Sigma and Mavericks = Elder System. Still, I’m not a 100% sure about any of this. Only time will tell, as a good story teller knows to never set a story in stone because you never know when you’ll want to change your plans (... don't quote me on that, its stupidity amazes me. I need to word things better). I think a lot of the MM series has changed over time, so originally things may have been more like my theory. Sure, there are plenty of other links like the Dark Elf also being called “Mother”, but I’ll leave that for you and your own research.

… Oh yeah, pictures. Here you go Sigma and his ever changing fashion sense. But guess what. These pictures won't load. Maybe they're too big or something. Well, there is a link to the site where they exist at the bottom of the post. Just go there and find them yourself... I'm lazy, what? Alright alright, I'll provide links...

Early Sigma… no prongs… just a nice gem MMX
www.vgmuseum.com/end/snes/a/megax-27.gif

Two prongy goodness (from X flashback) MMX4
www.vgmuseum.com/end/psx/a/mmx4mmc-14.jpg

Four prongs… that’s a change… MMX4
www.vgmuseum.com/end/psx/a/mmx4zero-03.gif

Lastly, Sigma from MMX5 with three prongs.
www.vgmuseum.com/end/psx/c/mmx5mav-03.png

Now think about this, Sigma has a symbol resembling the Master System symbol in the very same game in which “Elysium” is first mentioned. Also, since this was originally the last in the series… *spoiler for those who are to lazy to have already beaten the game*

^{Zero dies}

If X makes Elysium, and the source of the virus is long gone, the “Elder System” of Sigma and the Mavericks would have perished and there old bases would have become the ruins. X and the Hunters would found Elysium and then made peace with the humans and end the long war between the two systems, finally preventing Sigma from reactivating.

Of course, seeing Zero’s popularity, not to mention the X series’ popularity, Capcom decided to try and get more money by extending the X series and making the Zero series while the Legends series, which was probably going to be to next big focus after MMX5, fell into obscurity. Yeah, blame it all on Zero… Anyways, since they decided to not only bring zero and co back, but then give Zero his own game series would probably have resulted in some major changes to the overall course of events.

To put it simply, I theorize that originally the time line was Classic-X-Legends. A whole lot of the dialogue in the X series hints at this (Zero says that the Sigma virus has been destroyed, Elysium mention, and above mentioned spoiler all point to the X series ending), but then comes that evil thing known as greed. It caused the Capcom staff to delay the Legends series and focus on the ever popular Zero. In other words, the original links between X and Legends probably no longer exist in the same fashion that they had once existed. This means that new links must be forged in the form of the Zero series, and that means that Legends is getting pushed further and further back on the agenda, not to mention the original story line will have changed.

If they’ll just let the X series die and finish up the Zero series, Legends will be all clear to finish up the long running MM series. Who knows what’ll happen after Legends. Actually, that fact probably also has much to do with Capcom’s decision not to make MML3, because in theory it would be the end of the MM series, Capcom’s big money maker.

On the upside, since Legends is the finale of the series, they’ll probably put a lot of hard work into it… that or magically make another series that happens after Legends. I’m somewhat doubtful of a 2007 release date on MML3 because games take a long time to develop. It could take as long as five years, though it’d probably only take two or three years (I'm not a game designer, so this is based on estimates). What this does mean is that if Inafune said 2007, it’s either being made as we speak or is well on its way. Well, guess that’s all… yeah, I got way off topic here… Oh well *sigh*.

www.vgmuseum.com
That’s where all these pics were found. Check it out, they cover a lot of videogames old and new, and it seems like a nice place.

[SIMSteven]

GustaffGlyde said:

Now, what does that have to do with Sigma… I’m getting there. In Legends, they mention that for the Master System (Elysium) to be created, the Elder System and its people had to be destroyed. If X had a hand in making Elysium, the Elder System could have to do with Sigma and the mavericks. I’ve also thought that Neo-Arcadia might have been the Elder System and Zero and co. established the Master System, but the Zero series is something new, which means that it probably wasn’t in the original time line (it is in the new one though). This makes me think that X and hunters = Master System and Sigma and Mavericks = Elder System.

The Elder System and Neo Arcadia are two separate things. If you didn't notice in Zero 2, there are ruins. The same type of ruins from MML. The ruins are the Elder System, and Neo Arcadia is separate. You can't really factor in much of Zero other than this, though. If Zero wasn't created, Neo Arcadia wasn't created, then the ruins COULD HAVE been the people living on the planet. Before Zero, it was speculated that the towns of the X series are now the ruins in the Legends series. Now, this is nullified because of Zero.

Also, Elysium's origin has changed since X6-Zero. It was once X's dream to build a safe haven for all. Now that X has died, Capcom has a bit of explaining to do. I haven't played Zero 3 yet, as I will try to get it for Christmas.

GustaffGlyde said:

Now think about this, Sigma has a symbol resembling the Master System symbol in the very same game in which “Elysium” is first mentioned. Also, since this was originally the last in the series… *spoiler for those who are to lazy to have already beaten the game*

If X makes Elysium, and the source of the virus is long gone, the “Elder System” of Sigma and the Mavericks would have perished and there old bases would have become the ruins. X and the Hunters would found Elysium and then made peace with the humans and end the long war between the two systems, finally preventing Sigma from reactivating.

See above. Sigma's bases being the ruins are a long shot at best. They're totally different from the ruins of Legends. Also, the ruins in Zero are high security areas. They contain some of the most taboo weapons in the game. Why would Sigma's bases have them, if they were destroyed?